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Genders & Abridging
03-27-2013, 09:50 PM (This post was last modified: 03-27-2013 11:39 PM by 1KidsEntertainment.)
Post: #1
Genders & Abridging
(03-27-2013 09:30 PM)Truthordeal Wrote:  Man, I used to bitch about people doing that moaning shit all the time, but everyone defended it saying "well my token female VA is ok with it and that means its not sexist." It is sexist you dicks, and it's the reason there are so few female abridgers in this community.

I highly doubt that's the reason why there are so few female abridgers. I think it's for the same reason there are so few of them in my programming classes. Girls just tend to not like this stuff as much.

But yes it is sexist and bad.

Chances are, if you're reading this, it's after reading a ridiculously long post by me, something harshly phrased or confrontational, and/or me being stupid. I want to apologize for my above post, and end this signature with a quote of wisdom to soothe your soul.

"Ho ho..hoho hoho..santa for the wondering thismust be a joke in your series!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1"
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03-27-2013, 10:57 PM
Post: #2
RE: Sex Humor in Abridged Series
I've always wondered why there were more male abridgers than female. I know more female voice actresses than male in abridging, but few who create their own content.

I think part of it is that, apart from harem and moe series, there aren't too many popular anime that have large female casts. I mean, some shojou of course do, but most mainstream anime has large male casts. A lot of abridgers tend to do voices themselves at first and then branch out and get more VA's as they get experienced. I wonder if it has to do with that

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03-27-2013, 11:16 PM
Post: #3
RE: Sex Humor in Abridged Series
(03-27-2013 09:50 PM)1KidsEntertainment Wrote:  Girls just tend to not like this stuff as much.

I think its more of a cultural thing. I mean, women have the same brain as men. They're just put under a lot of pressure to act a certain way in a patriarchal culture. Look at every commercial aimed at women. Every magazine. Every TV show. This is where people get their identity these days. Before popculture it was the bible. Women got a raw deal, IMO. Girls are not encouraged to pursue the things that they are interested in the way boys are. On top of that, there is a very specific subset of interests that are pushed on to girls. Makeup, clothes, tanning, manicures, BOYS!!! It all involves their sexuality in one way or another. This is pressed on to girls at a very young age. But maybe all this will change in the future. Hopefully. Because we're losing a good 50% of our resources when it comes to creative and intellectual fields of interest.

TL;DR: Women aren't treated fairly. Feminists are going about this problem in the wrong way.

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03-27-2013, 11:37 PM (This post was last modified: 03-27-2013 11:42 PM by 1KidsEntertainment.)
Post: #4
RE: Sex Humor in Abridged Series
(03-27-2013 11:16 PM)Innagadadavida Wrote:  
(03-27-2013 09:50 PM)1KidsEntertainment Wrote:  Girls just tend to not like this stuff as much.

I think its more of a cultural thing. I mean, women have the same brain as men.

Eh, not from what I've heard, nor is that supported by a quick Google search.

https://www.google.com/#hl=en&gs_rn=7&gs...40&bih=775

The differences are surely not drastic, but there's no denying that they exist. What would be interesting to find out is if cultural differences between men and women can be linked to the differences in our brain structure, and furthermore, the evolutionary context behind it. For instance, a case could be made that the cause of patriarchal society is the generally higher levels of testosterone in men.

But anyways, this is a bit off topic so I'm gonna split it to a new thread. Feel free to continue discussing there.

Chances are, if you're reading this, it's after reading a ridiculously long post by me, something harshly phrased or confrontational, and/or me being stupid. I want to apologize for my above post, and end this signature with a quote of wisdom to soothe your soul.

"Ho ho..hoho hoho..santa for the wondering thismust be a joke in your series!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1"
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03-28-2013, 12:12 AM
Post: #5
RE: Genders & Abridging
Geez Louis, I feel like I'm posting on Emptyclosets.

As of now, I'm pretty sure it's a mix of both of what Inna and 1kids said.

Sadly, our world seems to like going "It's a boy!" or "It's a girl!" right when someone's born. And there's too much stigma into this shit, even if it's a bit understandable.

For one, it's gotten into people's sexual orientations. There are still lots of people going around going, "Okay now, Bobby. See that girl there? Now you go flirt with her, okay? And if you flirt with Timmy, you're going to hell because God in Leviticus says so," A lot of this is parents wanting to control their little preciouses' lives and make little mini-mes of themselves. It makes me sick.

Then there's what Inna said. No need to go in-depth here. He pretty much nailed it on the head on that one. However, this also plays into males as well. "Alright son, now you shoot that basket. If you don't make it, you're not going up in society"

Well, look where that got us. Boatloads of money going to people building up their bodies to play games where they throw a ball. Don't get me wrong. I love sports, especially coming from Chicago. I'm a huge White Sox fan, and I'm glad to hear how great the Hawks are doing. But all this money and effort needs to be dispersed somewhere else like medicine and other sciences. Sports can handle a bit less money... right?

This then comes into play with people like me: Transgender people. I myself am not transitioning, I'm not MtF or vice versa. I'm androgyne. I'm not going to fully explain. It really should be self-explanatory. As most of you may or may not know, transgender people have this thing called gender dysphoria. It's a fancy term for "I don't think I'm exactly the 'gender' what people think I am because of what's between my legs," It's an umbrella term. There's all sorts of genders. It's not just boy-girl. People are SO much more diverse than that. Gender is really different than sex. Which kind of makes me a bit mad that they don't teach you this in school, and ban the word "sex" which they really should be using for most of their flyers.

I mention transgender people, because studies HAVE shown that those who end up transitioning (transsexuals) usually end up having the same "kind" of brain that they end up transitioning to. It's really puzzling, but there's still a lot that goes on in the womb that we don't know about. In fact, it's this kind of stuff that's shown that homosexuality, or any sexuality, isn't a choice.

The other thing about gender is that it's really subjective, and we all try and make objective sense about it, which is why people do have gender dysphoria, and why there's feminism and all this kind of crap.

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03-28-2013, 12:48 AM (This post was last modified: 03-28-2013 12:50 AM by 1KidsEntertainment.)
Post: #6
RE: Genders & Abridging
The thing is, while "male" and "female" are largely, as you put it, humans trying to make objective sense of things, these are rooted in facts. People born with vaginas *tend* to have certain characteristics. People born with ballsacks *tend* to have certain characteristics. Biologically/evolutionarily speaking, humans are "supposed" to be born as male or female, even if individual personality traits will fluctuate. And usually? These will match their genitals. Are there exceptions? Of course, but these are a very small minority. They do not invalidate the overall study of the differences between most males and most females.

As for the topic at hand, I think that the lack of female abridgers is due to both cultural norms and biological tendencies. Culture can influence a lot of things, but it can't change everything. My sister might be told from a young age to value beauty over strength and pink over blue, but when it comes down to it, she still chooses barbies and sports and Death Note and Sailor Moon when given the opportunity. Culture is an influence, but it is rarely the deciding factor. To blame it entirely for the lack of female abridgers is a pretty large leap of faith to me.

I'd approximate that less than 10% of the students in my programming classes are female. Statistically, significantly less than 50% of the students with a declared major of adolescent education are male (in my school). Why is that? Do you really think that the majority of women (in a liberal place like NYC no less) haven't been given the chance to expose themselves to subjects that don't fit traditional gender roles to see if it appeals to them?

Chances are, if you're reading this, it's after reading a ridiculously long post by me, something harshly phrased or confrontational, and/or me being stupid. I want to apologize for my above post, and end this signature with a quote of wisdom to soothe your soul.

"Ho ho..hoho hoho..santa for the wondering thismust be a joke in your series!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1"
~A scholar beyond his time

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03-28-2013, 01:10 AM (This post was last modified: 03-28-2013 01:11 AM by concrete Building.)
Post: #7
RE: Genders & Abridging
I wasn't saying culture was the only factor. Again, I'll restate what I said before: It's a mix of both culture and biological (mostly evolutionary) differences. It seems we both agree on that. But what too many people do is rely on what they think the media says (not what the media actually does say), and then get all hissy about it. Most people aren't you and me, who actually do their research and think about what they want to know before coming to a conclusion.

As for why there are few females in abridging? Well, that could be from several factors. One could be that yes, as you put it, most females don't go in the direction of video games, filmmaking, programming, etc. and try and follow a path that's either good, but won't get them much (medicine and biology) or they'll go down a path that might get them a bit more cash, but isn't really that great in the long run, unless they're extremely lucky (modeling, acting). I'm really not trying to be sexist here. I think we can come to some understanding that lots of females do this, and it's not that much different in males, either.

Another factor could simply be that not that many females have been exposed to abridging. The ones that I have seen exposed to abridging HAVE wanted to do an abridged series, or help work on one, but simply don't have the time or the proper resources.

Another factor could be the sense of humor, which we've kind of discussed about. Hell, it's probably a mix of all of these, and we might be trying to pick out which one is more prominent and try and push it off as the only reason.

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03-28-2013, 08:45 AM (This post was last modified: 03-28-2013 08:47 AM by Truthordeal.)
Post: #8
RE: Genders & Abridging
The both of you are arguing against the wind. Even if we were to assume the traditional binary gender roles for a moment (i.e., boys like GI Joe and DBZ, girls like pink things and pony puff princesses) there is a huge female following in anime. Back when I was in high school, while us guys were going around talking about how cool Naruto was and buying our own headbands, the womenfolk were gushing about Inuyasha and the plausibility of KagomeXSesshomaru. Ever since the paradigm shift in anime around the mid-2000's, there's been a greater emphasis on rom-coms and slice of life stuff every season, as a way to market towards the growing female market.

The thing is, most abridgers tend to be anime fans, or at least have a cursory knowledge of a few shows. They'll watch TFS or LK or maybe PurpleEyes and want to make an abridged series of their own. If you ask the people on here, you will find that 90-95% started abridging given that general formula. For most abridgers, liking anime is almost a prerequisite. Furthermore, if you were to go on the VAA, their membership's gender ratio is much more equal. It may not be 50-50, but it's closer than we'll ever get.

So the question is, given the large female anime fanbase, why aren't there more female abridgers? Why are females more attracted to just doing voice acting work for fandubs over making inane anime Internet parodies? For the record, I don't even mean 50-50 here, I mean as much as 30-70. We can't even get that much.*

To be fair, on AF Live one time, Manitoug also proffered the explanation that in popular culture, females aren't considered funny. And yes, there seems to be some truth behind that; in most tv shows and movies, if there is a male lead and a female lead, the female lead tends to be more serious. Even if you look at abridged series, females tend to be the straight women over the males: in DBZA it's Bulma, in Pokemon 'Bridged it is (or was) Misty, in Code MENT it's C2 (insofar as Purps writes "straightmen").

So I'm not gonna deny that "girls aren't funny" may have some impact. But by and large, I think more of it has to do with these neophyte making their female characters, and by proxy, voice actors, moan incessantly thinking that "haha she's orgasming and that's a joke."** And moaning isn't even the only bad thing here; you still have people making PMS jokes, "get back in the kitchen" jokes, having their female characters fellate the main male character, etc. And you'll also notice on the VAA, that projects that are explicitly sexual tend not to have as many females audition for the role, or at least not as quickly.

If males were in the same position, mostly being used to make sex noises, there would be fewer males. I doubt anyone would find it acceptable if every black abridger was only expected to do the Harlem "I'mma shank you nigga" voice, or if every Hispanic or Latino abridger was only given the stereotypical Mexican character to play. I'm sure that happens, but it's harder to measure based on a character's voice; there are a ton of white people trying to make one of their characters a gangsta. Point is, you're making a certain group of voice actors think that the only thing that makes them worthwhile is that they happen to be black, or a female.

And the medium itself doesn't help. Ever since that paradigm shift I mentioned earlier, with more and more romance and slice-of-life stuff coming out to cater to females, production studios have relied on using more and more nudity and fanservice to keep the males interested. There are very few anime being currently produced that don't have a good deal of fanservice shoved in. Since every new season, you have a bunch of new abridgers making parodies of the newest anime, hoping to get popular, and dealing with highly sexualized material. As Inna said, in the hands of someone who knows how ridiculous sex can be, this could be funny. For those who don't, i.e., most abridgers, it ends up with the same old shit and the females always get the raw end of the deal.

tl;dr, here's my entire point: The people who make sex "jokes" are sending a very clear message to females that the only thing that makes them worthwhile are their genitalia. And that, more than anything else, is the reason why there are so few female abridgers.


*And in fact, I'll prove this. Name any three female abridgers (not just voice actors) and I will name at least ten male abridgers. I'll only use people who have a presence, so no obscure shit. Protip: If I haven't heard of them, they're probably obscure.
**Incidentally, the female orgasm is no laughing matter. It's a very rare and elusive creature. (that's still a very mediocre joke, but it's better than that shit).

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03-28-2013, 09:00 AM (This post was last modified: 03-28-2013 09:05 AM by SkyYuyo.)
Post: #9
RE: Genders & Abridging
(03-28-2013 01:10 AM)concrete Building Wrote:  Another factor could simply be that not that many females have been exposed to abridging. The ones that I have seen exposed to abridging HAVE wanted to do an abridged series, or help work on one, but simply don't have the time or the proper resources.

Another factor could be the sense of humor, which we've kind of discussed about.

Okay, I'm not going to go full on sociology involving gender roles here but these two points I have to agree with. The reason I can say this is because of what I gleaned from the discussions of a couple of females I know that have done/attempting to do a abridged.

The response I've gotten from girls who want have made/attempting an abridge have said:

That they've felt that most abridged series tend to be shounen or seinen involving guy main characters and because of this most of the time the girl characters tend to be one dimensional characters that they couldn't relate to.

This makes them usually seek out a show with a girl main character which is more then likely a Shoujo show. The problem with this that Hawk has pointed out is a lot of these female demographic shows tend to have a bunch of guy characters in them as well.

I mean it isn't a problem if they are going to voice everyone. Now this is only a guess but I feel because this a lot of them are going to go looking for people to fill in these roles. Then it just ends up being more then what they've bargained for originally. I don't mean to say this problem only exist for women abridgers but that is probably what's happening to the few females that do attempt to abridge. So, we just end up with them here and there.

Where there a lot more males that try to abridged and a quite a bit of them I imagine give up during the progress of making an abridged series as well but because there are so many more them interested in making show that we see a abundance of them compared to females.

I also think that girls tend to have a different style of comedy then what guys write. Not to say that I can't find that style to be funny and girls can't find things that guys write funny but for some it just ends up being a lot more relatable when it's your specific gender perspective.

( Damn! Truthordeal beat me to the part about fandubbing. Curse my hour long deliberation involving posting! This why I don't post here that much because it takes me forever to get my thoughts down.)

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03-28-2013, 09:04 AM (This post was last modified: 03-28-2013 09:04 AM by Chrome.)
Post: #10
RE: Genders & Abridging
(03-28-2013 08:45 AM)Truthordeal Wrote:  And moaning isn't even the only bad thing here; you still have people making PMS jokes, "get back in the kitchen" jokes, having their female characters fellate the main male character, etc.

+1 to your whole post and this bit especially.

Most sexist "jokes" are crap.

They can work among friends when the irony is appreciated but for a show they usually come across as lazy, uninspired and mean-spirited.
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03-28-2013, 12:10 PM
Post: #11
RE: Genders & Abridging
I would love to be in more stuff. However, I have noticed that the roles in abridged series for girls are very voice specific and not in a range that fits my voice. Most of the time the only stuff I see is the "cutesy/anime girl" role. That is not something I'm comfortable with. However, the voices in my range are more of that stuff that is over sexualized. You know the types of "come hither" deeper/sensual voices. That also makes me uncomfortable. Also, I know I don't have the skills nor the time to make an entire series by myself. I can write the scripts and voice a bit, but the editing is not something I can do.

tl;dr There seems to be a certain voice that everyone looks for that I don't have and the voice type I have is one that is typecasted as the sensual/over-sexual character.

So I feel kind of excluded in that regard.
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03-28-2013, 08:56 PM
Post: #12
RE: Sex Humor in Abridged Series
Going back to what TheHawk said,

(03-27-2013 10:57 PM)TheHawk Wrote:  I know more female voice actresses than male in abridging, but few who create their own content...

I think part of it is that, apart from harem and moe series, there aren't too many popular anime that have large female casts.

True, but they're are many lesser known anime which full female casts. Hentai / Ecchi anime just for horny adults could easily be turned into PG programming with the right amount of black bars.

I don't think any average viewer really cares what gender the creator is. If more females create content, that's great but regardless what sex they are, they should be given the same amount of scrutiny as everyone else. A lot of people quit before starting these sorts of projects because they fear judgement. I dislike judgement of others, and so do many other creators. It might be that the world just deals different hands to females in early life, giving them a different perspective on life and bigger dreams than to make a fan based parody.

(03-28-2013 12:10 PM)Kat Wrote:  I would love to be in more stuff. However, I have noticed that the roles in abridged series for girls are very voice specific... "come hither" deeper/sensual voices. That also makes me uncomfortable.

Understandable that female voice-actors do not want to be the punchline of a sex joke. Directors need avoid thinking that "Sex Sells". Its rare for it to actually work. *Also Kat, if you are interested, might have a roll for you in the future.*

(03-28-2013 08:45 AM)Truthordeal Wrote:  The people who make sex "jokes" are sending a very clear message to females that the only thing that makes them worthwhile are their genitalia. And that, more than anything else, is the reason why there are so few female abridgers.

I don't think its entirely like this but yes, others are inspired to recreate the joke in they're own production and see it as the normal joke to tell.

If any female is truly upset with the inequality of content from the sexes then getup and make some damn content.

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03-28-2013, 10:26 PM
Post: #13
RE: Genders & Abridging
Quote:If any female is truly upset with the inequality of content from the sexes then getup and make some damn content.

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03-28-2013, 11:13 PM (This post was last modified: 03-28-2013 11:14 PM by Innagadadavida.)
Post: #14
RE: Genders & Abridging
Relevant:




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03-29-2013, 02:57 AM
Post: #15
RE: Genders & Abridging
(03-28-2013 08:56 PM)Heavy_Bob Wrote:  Going back to what TheHawk said,

(03-27-2013 10:57 PM)TheHawk Wrote:  I know more female voice actresses than male in abridging, but few who create their own content...

I think part of it is that, apart from harem and moe series, there aren't too many popular anime that have large female casts.

True, but they're are many lesser known anime which full female casts. Hentai / Ecchi anime just for horny adults could easily be turned into PG programming with the right amount of black bars.

Sorry, but I'm not sure that Hentai/ Ecchi could be made PG with just a some black bars. The situations alone make that difficult. Also, I don't know a single girl, and only a handful of guys for that matter, who would want to spend several hours staring at the poorly drawn nipple of a anime girl while editing an episode. And with the imagery used in a lot of hentai, they have to sound flushed and moan to match the animation. I'd throw that idea out the window. I don't think using black bars in hentai is the answer to the problem.

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03-29-2013, 04:27 AM (This post was last modified: 03-29-2013 04:30 AM by TwooGiz.)
Post: #16
RE: Genders & Abridging
If Heavy Bob wasn't 100% serious with everything he said I might think he's a funny guy. Too bad he is serious with everything.

The video Inna linked pretty much solved this whole thread's agenda btw. Females don't make abridged series because they don't need them to get laid like males do.

(02-18-2012 12:30 PM)Airrest Wrote:  There's a certain charm to it that I don't think most people, even on this forum, are going to get or like.
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03-29-2013, 04:45 AM (This post was last modified: 03-29-2013 05:56 AM by Ezekieru.)
Post: #17
RE: Sex Humor in Abridged Series
(03-27-2013 10:57 PM)TheHawk Wrote:  I think part of it is that, apart from harem and moe series, there aren't too many popular anime that have large female casts.

I don't think this is the case, as in most abridged series, the females are just voiced by men trying to sound feminine, and it could easily be the other way around, with a female abrigder doing all the male voices while sounding manly.

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03-29-2013, 05:56 AM (This post was last modified: 03-29-2013 05:56 AM by Ezekieru.)
Post: #18
RE: Sex Humor in Abridged Series
(03-29-2013 04:45 AM)YamiMario Wrote:  
(03-27-2013 10:57 PM)TheHawk Wrote:  I think part of it is that, apart from harem and moe series, there aren't too many popular anime that have large female casts.

I don't think this is the case, as in most abridged series, the females are just voiced by men trying to sound feminine, and it could easily be the other way around, with a female abrigder doing all the male voices while sounding manly.

Except no, with most anime there are far more male characters than female characters, so in order for a woman to do an abridged series of a typical show, the majority of voices she would have to do would be falsettos. It is not the same as for a dude.

I think that's the reason so many ladies flock to the magical girl genre of anime: The girls on those shows usually have more fleshed out characteristics than the average male-focused show, and the vast female cast far outweigh the male casting. Back in the beginning it was Sailor Moon, with its five/six main females, plenty of female minor cast, and even the main villains were often ladies. Nowadays it's Madoka Magica, with five main female characters, plenty of minor female roles, and the only notable male roles would be Madoka's brother and dad, Sayaka's crush Kyousuke, and even possibly Kyubey.

And don't even talk about how a female abridger can just cast the male roles of non-magical girl anime. We're talking about solo female abridgers, not female voice actresses. So I believe, alongside somewhat with what Inna is saying, that the lack of suitable shows prevents a lot of female abridgers from emerging.

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03-29-2013, 11:59 AM
Post: #19
RE: Genders & Abridging
(03-29-2013 04:27 AM)TwooGiz Wrote:  If Heavy Bob wasn't 100% serious with everything he said I might think he's a funny guy. Too bad he is serious with everything.

*Serious Response*

I didn't think I was serious about everything... Was just putting out the who really gives a hoot response to the topic. Does anyone really want to see more woman creating content? No, not directly seeking it. Its a good thought but nobody should care what gender the creator is. If the content is good then people will like it, if its not then nobody will watch it.

*Stupid Response*

Men started this topic and continue to debate about it. HUR HUR, WOMEN HAVE VAGINAS AND MEN HAVE BALLS, BAHAHHAHAH!

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03-29-2013, 01:17 PM (This post was last modified: 03-29-2013 01:21 PM by SkyYuyo.)
Post: #20
RE: Genders & Abridging
Well although I haven't been directly seeking abridging content by gender it is still interesting to see for me. It wouldn't hurt if there were more of them.

Heck I wish there was more abridges out there being made. I don't even know what is good anymore. Most people I've follow for abridging has been dormant for quite some time and everything I run in to now a days feels like the same kind of comedy style but that is just my opinion/problem.

I try to make a point to search abridged by upload date every now and then. Finding people starting out and if I feel that they have potential to leave and comment in probably a vain effort to encourage them in hope that they stick with it. Just to get some new blood in the abridging world.

As It feels like everything has been plateaued in the abridging world for me.

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